The Fish
for 7 August 2000. Updated every WEEKDAY.
Suck Staff
[Tim Cavanaugh]
Tim Cavanaugh
Special Guest Editor
Terry Colon
Terry Colon
Art Director
Heather Havrilesky
Heather Havrilesky
Senior Editor
[Phillip Bailey]
Helen Kim
Andy Slipka
Mia Steinberg
Suck Prod Temps
Joey Anuff
Joey Anuff

Suck Alumni
Suck Alumni Text
Before the Body's Cold

Where are the old suck people. They
were funny. Why is the site not, which would be more

James Dornan

Oh, gosh. Oh, wow. What a great
put-down!! Oh, wow!
Never heard that before! You sure
got me! Woo!

And, hey, I'm not one to make
suggestions to such a rapier wit,
but it would have been even funnier
if you'd actually pulled your head
out at any point in the last three
months and made it or

You chimp.

Greg Knauss

Fish With Letter Icon

I don't like it, but I have to
agree with your opinion.


David Knowles

Honestly, I don't like it either,
not one bit. It's an enormous
shame, a loss for the entire Web.

But, unfortunately, there's really
no arguing the point anymore. I
wish Sparky, my childhood pet,
weren't dead, too. But I'm sure as
hell not going to keep his body
propped up in the living room,
waiting for the day he makes his
triumphant return.

Greg Knauss

Fish With Letter Icon

If we shut down every bloated
collection of half-thoughts, we
would have to get rid of articles
like yours too. I realize that you
guys spend your time passing your
writing through a sort of
fuzz-guitar amplifier for text
until the feedback hurts everyone,
but I think you're a bit wrong
here. I like the current version of
Mozilla. Call me strange, but I
don't even think it's bad at all.

Peter Wayner

You're strange. Misguided, too. The
article may have been a bloated
collection of half-thoughts, but at
least I finished it. That's the
point, remember? Mozilla has had
over two years to fester and has
produced nothing but a vague
gone-bad smell and a series of ugly
betas. Until the Project actually
works up the gumption to ship
something - something other than a
milestone - Mozilla can't even be
called a "half-thought."

Greg Knauss

Fish With Letter Icon

Yeah, but they throw cool parties.

Matthew Cunningham

Now that you mention it, the
Mozilla Project has repeatedly
demonstrated that it's much better
at throwing parties than it is at
shipping code. Three parties in two
years compared to - what? - a
single beta release in that time?

Hell, forget this software crap,
Mozilla needs to re-purpose itself
as a catering service.

Greg Knauss

Fish With Letter Icon

Quick, before they fix
your article. The sucksters have
inadvertently stuck a new ending on
it. See if you like it better that
way...then scream your head off.

Alan Kornheiser

Actually, just randomly mixing in
bits of other Suck pieces can only
improve mine. I'm hoping to one day
sound like St. Huck, Bartel D'Arcy,
the Duke of URL and Webster, all
mixed together.

Greg Knauss

Fish With Letter Icon

Nice article Greg.

Just a little FYI, Microshaft also
tried that "one browser fits all"
thing about four years with similar
stupefying results. In fact, the
Windoze98 desktop was originally
going to look, feel, and act a
BROWSER! Jeepers, it's ugly enough
as it is, yipes! Anyways, in the
betas the public hated it, not just
for look feel, but it's bloated
size (like it's company). Although
Microshaft is big at duping the
general public into "you need
bigger, badder, more - MHz matters
- it's shitty, shut up and deal
with it - etc." and usually trying
to get them to upgrade their
machines piecemeal at a time, they
couldn't figure out how to coax the
consumers into getting a new 20
gigabyte hard drive just to support
their spiffy OS. They backed down,
natch, and produced shitty Win98
and that begat Win2000, same look
you've come to love and barf chunks
to with merely bug fixes under the
hood to support why you spent the

Hey, keep on sucking!


Like I have any choice.

And as for Microsoft's "Web-Enabled
Desktop," yeah, it was a disaster,
too. But at least they had a
customer-feedback mechanism to
convince them - to the point of
messages written in blood - that it
was something that people didn't
actually want. Mozilla, near as I
can tell, does no research into
what you or me or Joe Average wants
from a Web browser, and it's
killing them.
What someone needs to do is get
some fluorescent orange paint and
their parking lot.

Greg Knauss

Fish With Letter Icon

I'm not going to rant and rave and
swear about your article, as
everyone's entitled to an opinion,
but just say:

Think before you act. The things
you mentioned about Mozilla are
strange; Bloated - Then why is it
smaller than IE WITH all the
debugging code? Cross-Platform
technology - Are you a Microsoft
employee or what? There are people
who don't use Windows (now that's
what I call bloated suftware!) XML
- In case you hadn't noticed,
Office 2000 actually uses this as a
file format, which kinda makes it
important to be able to read it.
Mail client, etc - Some of us don't
use IE (I know it's hard to
believe) and don't want to have to
install a separate program, just
have it all in one. Oh, and it's
actually learning from the mistakes
of Netscape; don't be narrow-minded
and live in the past, get the stuff
of tomorrow today.

George Sharp

I'm going to be patient with you,
George, because you're English and
already have a lot of embarrassment
to contend with. But, to take your
"points" in order:

Bloat: I don't know that IE is the
application you want to be
comparing yourself against when
you're arguing that Mozilla isn't
bloated. "Golly, Clem, you're a
damned sight slimmer than that
circus fat lady! Have another

Cross-Platform Technology: Yes, I'm
aware that there are non-Windows
users in the world. I'm one of
them. The ability to write code so
that it compiles on different
operating systems has nothing -
nothing - to do with nonsense like
XPCOM, XUL or the cross-platform
widgets. They're toys, Georgie.

XML: The ability to parse XML would
certainly be a nice feature. Say,
in version 2. Or 3. Or maybe even
1.1, if you're feeling ambitious.
But, for now, just get the damned
browser out. XML doesn't help the
browser one tiny bit.

Mail Client, Etc.: So let me get
this straight. You think that it's
OK that Mozilla is years - years! -
behind schedule just to save you
the trouble of installing Eudora?
How long has it been since you took
the blow to the head?

You suffer from the same disease
the Mozilla developers do, George.
You value the fuzzy, ill-defined
future over the present. The
future's great and all, yeah, but
we actually have to live here. And,
apparently, we have to do it
without a decent browser.

Greg Knauss

Fish With Letter Icon

Hit & Run


I'm no flag-bearer for morphing,
but, in truth, does any rail scream
"1994" quite as embarrassingly as
those against morphing?

As well, you'll note that a morph,
subtly rendered, can be a
provocative, destabilizing image;
see the one at the end of the *What
Lies Beneath* trailer, as the
antagonist utters the line, "Your
wife..." to a frazzled Harrison

Great take on *The Perfect Storm*,
though. Impressive, when I first
saw the trailer in the theatre;
have yet to see the movie, if only
for that reason. Meanwhile, on the
other hand, I've yet to tire from
the smarmy wit of what, to me, is
one of the great movie metaphors in
cinematic history: that of 1600
Pennsylvania Ave being stripped to
the atomic nucleus by an exawatt
alien ray gun in *Independence

Suck on,

Harry Allen

We'll assume you're joking about
the trick in the What Lies Beneath
trailer, which we suspect
discouraged more potential viewers
than it brought in. But there's
nothing more dismal than an effect
that's supposed to be really cool
but isn't. And morphing, whether
it's a morph of an X-Files villain,
of Shaq in Steel, or of Matt Damon in
Saving Private Ryan, is an effect
we can no longer look on without
feeling an acute sense of regret
and shame.

yr pal,

Morphin' Downey Jr.

Fish With Letter Icon


Just wanted to write and thank you
for referring to Shining Time
Station " an enduring if
inexplicable favorite among
still-drooling viewers." This
article made my day. I played
"Matt", the lovable moptop, on
Shining Time for the first Season
and a half before being replaced by
cheaper, more Canadian kids and
it's always funny to accidentally
find some kind of reference to it.
Suck just keeps getting better and
better. The Martin Lawrence piece
was mind blowing. What an
egotistical bastard. Back in my
day, I never asked to more than 3

keep up the good stuff,


You have a kindred spirit here. Or
you did, at any rate: Phil Bailey,
Suck's dearly departed production
guy, was once a star on the
Northern California version of
Romper Room. [Special alert for
Central Jersey headbangers: Phil's
band Systematic will be opening for
Napstercides Metallica at the
Meadowlands later this month. We
wish Phil the very best in his new
career as a rock and roll

Lovable Moptop

Fish With Letter Icon

You guys are just so arch.

Harley Davis

It's all so perfectly fucking
grand, isn't it?


Fish With Letter Icon

Robinson Crane: Kelsey Grammer
Marooned Again

"...that group of people
shipwrecked on that island, slowly
turning against each other."

But I still can't quite figure out
why I can't stop hearing Mr.Magoo's
voice when I read the Kelsey
Grammer cartoon.


I think it's because Terry's
illustration brings out the
Magooean sense of perserverance
that characterizes Grammer's
never-say-die efforts to transcend
his status as Frasier Crane. An
excellent artistic choice on
Terry's part, I say...


Fish With Letter Icon

"Olivier, or Branagh, or Selleck."

A non sequitur if ever I read one.
Great job on the rest of it,


Go back and look at the work. Three
Men and a Baby
compares favorably
with anything in the Olivier and
Branagh canons if you ask me. A lot
of that's due to the presence of
Gutenberg, of course, but Selleck
more than holds his own.


Fish With Letter Icon

 The Shit
Krushchev Remembers, by Nikita Krushchev (authorship disputed), translated by Strobe Talbott
Five-Star Day Cafe
Athens, Ga.
Salon's "Action Figures"
TV ad
Donna's Famous "Long and Short of It," by Donna Anderson and friends
Two-Lane Blacktop, directed by Monte Hellman (The Anchor Bay/Universal letterboxed edition)
George Bush, Dark Prince of Love: A Presidential Romance, by Lydia Millet (Scribner)
King Kong: The Complete 1933 Film Score, by Max Steiner Moscow Symphony Orchestra, William J. Stromberg conductor (Marco Polo)
Eightball #20, by Dan Clowes (Fantagraphics Books)
The ECW's Little Spike Dudley
Stan Kenton, City of Glass, featuring arrangements by legendary weirdo Bob Graettinger (EMD/Blue Note)
Comix 2000, Edited and published by L'Association, 2000
Star Dudes
Do you know of stuff that doesn't actively suck? Things so good they deserve to make the Shitlist? Send your suggestions to us.

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